Longtime Palm fans will remember Ebag333's investigations into the drama of true standalone, autonomous GPS on Windows Mobile Treos. He's back at it for the Palm Pre, looking into whether or not the GPS module on the Pre can work without a data connect. Turns out it can, but it takes some doing. Ebag in the forums have been tinkering with the Qualcomm GPS equipment and its associated drivers in the CDMA version of the Pre. They've been able to gain access to additional GPS modes that'll work without that active data connection, including Autonomous, Assisted, and Cached. Read: true, standalone GPS.
The hack isn't terribly useful at this point outside of an area without data coverage, as webOS currently doesn't have much in the way of standalone software written for it to take advantage of such a scenario, such as TomTom for the iPhone. Where the hack does come in handy, however, are acquisition times and overall accuracy: currently it can take 30 seconds to 2 minutes to get a lock using aGPS, and the accuracy of the lock can be hit or miss. The changes this hack makes can vastly improve both of those items.
These modifications are certainly not for the faint of heart, as the steps here are rather involved (think proprietary Qualcomm programs, MSL numbers, and Palm SDK's). Honestly, unless you are a hardcore GPS chip nerd, we suggest you observe rather than act - flashing GPS chips can be risky business.
Thanks Ebag for the tip!
Comments
Any added hit to the battery on this? The battery is already sucked dry quite quickly with GPS running.
Actually, your battery life should improve since in theory it takes less time to acquire a GPS signal. After the GPS signal is acquired, it will drain your battery nearly the same as it would before applying this hack.
replace that stock battery!
My GPS is still very hit or miss! Sometimes it can't find my location, sometimes it will lose my location, and sometimes I have no problems!! Not very reliable!!
Does anyone out there know how to make 64 bit drivers and would volunteer to take beezlewaxin's drivers and make them 64 bit compatible?
The "Get Starbucks" app actually pulls your location (latitude, longitude, and altitude) without a data connection. (Of course you have to dismiss the google maps app it wants to open after grabbing the location). Of the 8 locations I pulled and subsequently mapped on google earth, only one was inaccurate.
"think proprietary Qualcomm programs, MSL numbers, and Palm SDK's"
Actually, the SDK is no longer required.
is someone going to make a patch for this......i had no idea that the pre has a "real gps" patch atenna....if someone is going to make a patch please message me.....
I doubt this is something that can be done with a patch.
So Go To Tool and vCrumbs require data connectivity without these changes? That's disappointing.
I mildly object to the second-to-last paragraph, as I find these types of tools very valuable. I understand that stand-alone navigation is a more common request, though.
This tweak does not effect the functionality of any programs, simply the way that the GPS works on the Pre.
The Go To Tool and vCrumbs do what they do very well, but they are not a full fledged mapping application. The point of the second-to-last paragraph is that you do not have full GPS functionality off network as you need a data connection to download the maps with the current programs out there. If all you want is a breadcrumbs type application, then Go To and vCrumbs will work perfectly. Without this tweak they will only work when you have a data connection however, as the GPS will only work with a data connection.
Most users will want the full mapping functionality off network, and will be disappointed that they cannot use Google Maps or Sprint Nav when they have no data connection.
Is there any way to store maps on the Pre? Then the Pre wouldn't need the data connection & be just like a standalone GPS unit.
How is it possible for GPS unassisted by cell tower location to get a lock faster than assisted GPS? I thought the whole point of aGPS was that it decreased time to lock. Is it that the aGPS system takes a long time to get a lock only in the presence of a weak cell signal, or is this a general statement?
It's actually not the standalone part that is decreasing the time, but the cached part.
For speed of acquiring the satellites, cached will be the fastest simply because the device has stored the information on where the sats are, so it does not need to go out to a server to download the information (aGPS) or find it mathmatically (standalone).
AGPS will be the second fastest as typically downloading the information will be quicker than finding it mathmatically.
Standalone is the slowest, but it makes an excellent fall back method if the aGPS server is unavailible and the cached information is out of date, incorrect, or incomplete.
Can you use this to turn the Pre into a GPS receiver and pass the data along to a PC over USB and use it with Streets & Trips, etc.?
There is a GPS mode for the Pre that in theory could allow it to be used as a GPS receiver. (Found in ##usbpass#.)
At this time there are no drivers that support it, however.
This is the first thing that came to mind for me too... except I'm a big Delorme fan.
I have wanted this since day one. I commonly travel to remote areas and international areas where data connection is not available. I want to use FitTrack to track the distances of my runs as well as be able to use the GoTo app to do geocaches where there is also little data network coverage. PLEASE MAKE A PATCH FOR THIS!!!!!!
> webOS currently doesn't have much in the way of standalone software written for it to take advantage of such a scenario...
Au contraire, one item important to me is built right into a first-party application, namely the geotagging option for the photos taken on the phone.
Recently I was on a cruise off Alaska, taking lots of photos with my Pre (and serious cameras also of course!). I naively thought the Pre photos would provide geotags that I could transfer to the "good" pictures. Really disappointed that only the ones taken right in Anchorage and Juneau had any geotags at all.
Odd, Didn't know it didn't work without data currently. Fit track worked for me when I was just outside Canyon De Chelly, in Chinle, AZ where I was roaming without any data (I kept getting the no data message, so I shut off roaming data). This would imply that it was already working without a data connection. As was stated before I even got the phone, if you use the Sprint Navigator, start off in a location with service and head into a location without data service, the phone is supposed to still transmit directions. I never tried this, but I do know you need a data connection to start the Sprint Navigation
@rufflez - you are correct, and that feeds into my comment about the misnomers in this article. My issue is with the mis-use of "GPS" for "Navigation". They are related parts of a whole. (Like people who call a PC tower a "CPU").
The Pre "does" indeed have a fully functional GPS (Global Positioning System) chip that can obtain coordinates freely. What the Pre doesn't have is standalone Navigation only because it stores no map data. However the "GPS Navigation" still works perfectly w\o data, you just get static images instead of a map.
Don't believe it? A test then...
1- Turn off your Wifi radio.
2- Go into the phone app preferences and turn data off.
3- Confirm you have no data connection by opening the browser.
3- Return to the dialer and enter ##GPS# on the keypad
4- You are in the GPS app. Press "Get Fix".
In about 20-30 secs, you will have your GPS coordinates displayed solely using the chip it self. It is slower because that is *true* GPS and not the A-GPS that we normally get.
Conduct the same test with SprintNav and you will see you are being "navigated" perfectly only being shown "where to go" instead of "where you are going". Turn data back on and voila, pretty maps again.
HTH
Will this patch increase the accuracy of the Geotagging - that is what I am looking for
So final verdict, If I have no service whatsoever (roaming, 1x, evdo, wifi or other) will my photos be tagged?
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